I am looking for painting material ...

[Zenigata]

First of all, I am sorry that I can write only in English, because I cannot read or write German.

I come from Japan and I live in a suburb of Stuttgart.
I started new hobby in Germany, “loudspeaker building” and I am close to complete the boxes.
But I have big problem. I cannot find painting material at all.

My box is made of two parts. One is veneer finished box(Birke-Multiplex). The other is baffle board(MDF).
I want very glossy, transparent urethane coat finish for the veneer finished box.
I also would like to apply color to the veneer or coating layer.
For the baffle board, I would like to apply glossy black urethane coat finish, like black piano.


I prefer two component urethane painting material.
Probably I need to buy some kinds of materials for some steps in the painting / sanding procedure.

I would like to buy small portion to test it, then I would like to buy full portion, if possible.
Please let me know what product name and where I can buy.
If I can get advice in English at the shop, it’s perfect!

Thanks

 

[Rühl]

Hi,



to fill: http://www.hesse-lignal.de/pdf/ti/en/DP_491-(FT)_en.pdf


to finish: http://www.hesse-lignal.de/pdf/ti/en/DB_449-(FT)_en.pdf



Good luck

Ulf

 

[edelres]

Spray finish

Hi Zenigata,

as I understand your request is finding the material to finish your Boxes. To achive a finish as you described, you need a spray equipment and an Room to spray in, I don't know your level of experience to do this kind of work.

As I'm informed the smalest quantity of finish(laquer) is a liter.

In your case I would look for a body shop= Autolakiererwerkstadt and let them do the finishishing work. May you shop around to find out different prices. You can ask also a furniture maker = Schreiner and look for a Schreinerwerkstatt and ask there for help.

I'm a professional in Restoration, high gloss finish I let it do from body shop, it cost me here in California less then I would have to spend for the material, beside the time I saved!

Welcomme to woodworker.de I hope you will find the right place, if you have any future questions feel free to ask for.

Best regards

Ottmar

PS: I admire the urushi lacquer work of the old Japanese Masters.

 

[n0ri]

Hola Zenigata

First of all... grats to your new Hobby
Could u show some pictures of your boxes or is there a construction review?

As I'm informed the smalest quantity of finish(laquer) is a liter.

Thats right!!
For my last project ill tryed to buy some paint to test it but my seller sayd the minimum quantity is a liter!

To achive a finish as you described, you need a spray equipment and an Room to spray in, I don't know your level of experience to do this kind of work.

I can agree with this too.
It isnt possible to produce a high glossy finish at home without the right equipment (dust-free room, spray equipment).

I often paint my boxes with Schöner-Wohnen colour. Thats no PUR-paint so its possible to use a roll (which i prefer cuzz i havent a painting equipment too).

So if u wanna try painting the box your own u should use something like MDF-Grund as a ground coat (its 0,75 litre only ) for 2-3 layer. After each step of painting its necessary to grind the layer with 120er-grinding paper. After the last grounding step u should use 180er-grinding paper.

After these u can paint the coloured layer (in your case black) in 2-3 steps.
After each layer u have to grind again (240).

After each step of grinding the layer u have to clean the whole box unless theres no dust!!

After some layers of black paint u can dispose if the result is what u want.
If u want a glossier finish u have to repeat the painting steps using clear varnish since the result is perfect.

The glossy effect is a result of the clear varnish layers.

 

[Zenigata]

Thank you very much Ulf, Ottmar, and n0ri,

Ulf,
I will study the links you gave me Thank you very much!

Ottmar,
My level of experience is --> totally beginner. Actually, I even didn’t know what router is 5 month ago.
Painting with urethane is also what I found on the internet. There are some websites with detailed instruction (Japanese) but they write specific products sold only in Japan. I tried to import them to Germany, but painting materials are usually rejected to send internationally......
Because I am totally beginner, I had better have some experiment and exercise myself. A litter may be good portion for me.
Actually I look for professional for painting too. It is mainly because I am so tired of looking for painting material over the internet and probably very difficult to find painting instruction for beginners.
On the other hand, I am doubtful if the professional painter will understand my request well … because I cannot speak German language.
Thank you for the key words, yes, with this information, I would not have so much difficulty in research….

n0ri,
I actually had experiments of Osmo oil with many kinds of wood samples which I asked at BauMarkt. Some experiments are successful and I am able to paint some with acceptable color. But, as you told, I had dusts on them, Yes
Yes, I need to think about the cost for the tools such as spray gun and the room….
By the way, thank you for the links of Schöner-Wohnen and the instruction!
I will check it with google translation

I will find the way to show you the photo of my speaker boxes. It is still on the way of wood work.
I still need to attach side walls to them though I got inflammation to tendons of my both hands … I was too much absorbed in wood works, its so FUN!!

 

[n0ri]

Hey...

I´ve thought a bit about your problem...

Some time ago i´ve seen this review. The guy produced a beatiful result only using aerosols for painting his boxes (have a look at the picts).

The costs are a bit higher than using a roll but its ok if u only paint the baffle.

The steps (painting/grinding/cleaning......painting/grinding/cleaning) are the same as using a roll or special painting equipment.

By the way:
Here u can see my boxes (without glossy finish).


update:

U could look around for a specialist whos painting the boxes for u.
Ask if it is possible that u do the grinding job so the costs are a bit lower!

As u see there so much ways u can paint your boxes:rolleyes:

 

[Zenigata]

Hello I find the way to upload my photographs. They are my first speakers!

Zenigata Galerie - Photos

 

[n0ri]

Hello I find the way to upload my photographs. They are my first speakers!

Really good work... grats
Did u follow an advice or something? Or did u build it up fully your own?

The only problem i see is that u used screws to fix the baffle...
Ive read about the problem that filled holes (with screws) showed up after painting and finishing the paint job.

But iam crossing my fingers for you and your work and would like to see more pictures of the future steps

 

[Zenigata]

Hello n0ri,
Actually I bought my driver units at Inter Technic and I checked the site you told me.
Before checking the website, I was thinking about square design. But after finding the site, I changed my design to the oval design.

By the way, your speakers are nice! Thank you for the photo. How is their sounds? I guess it is nice with good bass sound.

Thank you for compliments. Unfortunately, I had nobody to consult so I had to solve all problems by myself.
The most complicated work for me was to curve round faces at both of the side - upper of baffles. I made big jig to curve them.
About the holls of screw, I plan to fill the holls with wood sticks then I will apply veneer. I hope it will not affect badly …
(If you are talking about the six holls on baffles, they remain as holes. They are screws with hexagonal lench hole. I will leave the baffle detachable.

I will upload photos when I take more!

 

[n0ri]

By the way, your speakers are nice! Thank you for the photo. How is their sounds? I guess it is nice with good bass sound.

The Sound is good and the bass is nice too but meanwhile i´ve buildet up some more for my fam and friends which sounds a bit better in my oppinion so i will change my system in the near future.

Thank you for compliments. Unfortunately, I had nobody to consult so I had to solve all problems by myself.

Again... u did a really great job...
Did u cut the single parts ure own or is this cnc-work?

(If you are talking about the six holls on baffles, they remain as holes.

Right...
I´ve no idea (its a little late and iam learning for my very last lesson tomorrow) but i would fill the holes with something (let me think about it) so u have a clear view without viewable holes or something but still with the oppinion to open the box whenever u want.

In the meantime u could have a look on the whole lautsprecherbau.de Homepage (Udo created so much really great boxes) or those sub-forums of hifi-forum.de.
1. User Projects (theyr own boxes)
2. Boxes build up following instructions

Sometimes u have to scroll a little but there so much interesting pictures it is worth the price

 

[Zenigata]

Hi n0ri,
I looked for what is "CNC". Probably it is something which can cut wood according to programmed data. Then it is nice tool!
All what I used for cutting are jigsaw and router. So, I made many mistakes. >_< Haha, no way, considering that I am totally beginner.

About the holes, I use M8 screw with silver color now. But I found black too. If I can find gold, then I think gold may be the best. If I cannot find gold, I will compare if black is better or silver is better.
Anyway, I don’t hide the screws for attaching driver units. I will choose ones with same design with the driver screw. Then I think it is rather cool to show. I plan to show the hole and screw.
And after the completion of the box, I still need to open the box very often in order to tune the amount of damping material, the volume of the chamber, and the network circuit. I thought that it will be annoying if I need to remove driver unit every time.
I guess, it will take few years in order to finish this tuning phase although I use Speakerworkshop for designing the box and network circuits.

Thank you for the links. I checked some articles in the links. Although I cannot read German, the pictures are good to get new ideas.

Actually, my box designe was totally changed when I saw the following links.

120-leserecho-bluenote
42-jogis-bluenote

Please show me your other works too

 

[n0ri]

Hey Zenigata,

how about your boxes?
Is there something new u can show us?

Iam finishing my second study path in june so iam already looking around for my next project

 

[Heimkino]

Hello Zenigata,

welcome to this woodworker board.

Your project looks nice and very interisting. Iám looking for a long time for projekts with this shape.

The following links show speakers with a shape like yours, maybe you can catch some more information about the best way to get rounded sidewalls.

Schlanke Oval-Standbox - Visaton Diskussionsforum

Projektbericht Symphonie oval - Visaton Diskussionsforum

Bau meiner VOX301

This links are all from Visaton.de, it´s a manufactur for DIY-speaker. They made chassis, develop the housing and the corssover network.

This is one of the most recommend sites for DIY-Speakers without self developing of speakers systems (volume and crossover network).

All plans are og the speakers are downloadable.


regards

Werner

 

[Zenigata]

Hello n0ri, and Werner!!

> n0ri,
I could not obtain 3mm birke maltiplex for long. But I just obtained at the end of last week. Now I am applying the side walls. I have done 5 layers of a box so far.
My box is a little too big comparing the ones I saw in the past. So I can not use clamps as they use. I am applying the wall with a little different way accordingly.

What kind of project are you planing?

>Werner,
Thank you for the link!
Actually, my way of applying wood is similar to the one in your link.
ImageShack® - Online Photo and Video Hosting
I pinch the front part and squash with the behind.

I will upload photos when I take some

By the way, everybody paints nice!

Regards

Zenigata

 

[Zenigata]

Hi !
I have completed wood work and have uploaded the photo!
Zenigata

 

[n0ri]

Hey zenigata...

Nice to hear you after such a long time

U really did a great job for the moment and i hope to see more pictures during the painting/finishing process...

In 2 months my 2. study is done and i hope to get a interesting and well payed job very soon because iam looking forward to build new speakers too.

Regards

n0ri

 

[Zenigata]

Hi n0ri!

Nice to hear from you again ^^

Conglaturations for your study! I hope you will get interesting, well paid job with lots of vacation days for speaker project!

What kind of plan of project do you have?

One of my acquaintance told me that one way full range back load hone speaker is nice.
I also heard that not only incredible sound range considering single cone but incredible resolution because the sound come out from small point without any passive networks.
But it is not easy to listen such speakers unless you build it by yourself because such spekers are not sold except for Tannoy.
I am curious about it. Please make it if you like ^^


I still have not decided abaout painting. May be I will do it by myself may be I ask somebody else.
I actually am not decided how to divide the signal to 3 ways. I mean passive network or active divider. ^^;>>

Please show pictures of your next speakers!

Regards.

Zenigata

 

[n0ri]

Hey Zenigata,

What kind of plan of project do you have?

Iam not really sure yet and still looking for "the right" project.

My last project was the "Elip2" for my brother (I will make some pictures during this week). Comparing to my FirstTime8 the Elip2 is much nicer when u listen to music (and theyr just a few € more expensive). So iam thinking about selling my boxes and building up those boxes for my own.

One of my acquaintance told me that one way full range back load hone speaker is nice.

This is a option iam thinking about.
My uncle owns full range fostex horns (dunno exactly which ones but i can ask for eventually). Theyr sound is excelent and your not able to locate the boxes with closed eyes.

A third option iam thinking about is the CheapTrick 250 which is published in the "Klang&Ton 5/2010". The price is a bit higher than the Elip2 (~210€) but a way cheaper than the jericho horns. Problem is that i have roof pitches in my living room so 1,80m is a bit to high. Theres a second way to build this boxes in a lower way (here) but iam not sure if i like it in the end.

And then theres my Dream the Duetta - "Queen of Blues":rolleyes:
But with a price of 800€ each (without wood) a "bit" to expensive for me


So u see everything is possible and iam open for different kinds of projects.

 

[Zenigata]

Hello n0ri,

Since you are going to start working, you can get your duetta easily ^^

I uploaded two more photos. I attached the drivers.
They are all Seas.

Woofers: W26FX-001
Squawker: W16NX001(4ohm)
Tweeters: T29CF002, ”CRESCENDO”

The total driver cost is more than 2000 eur.

I actually went to Highend show in Munchen. I am interested in very expensive Dali speakers but on the other hand, I thought I can make them.
I heard that the price of driverset in speaker boxes is only 10% of list price. The target of my speakers is ... to get my ideal speaker with cheap price.

Go to your dream speaker!